This conversation has too many mistakes. It makes us look unintelligent, but I guess it’s a real conversation. ~ Anonymous
So you want to know how technical writers spend the day? Several months ago, I wrote a winning post titled “Typical Day as a Technical Writer.” That post received more hits than any of my other posts. It was a post about my typical day as a technical writer, as the title suggests. I guess people are curious to learn and read about what I do as a technical writer. I’ve also received several comments and messages from other technical writers about the striking similarity between my typical day and their typical day.
Well, today’s post is not really a post but an excerpt from a “typical conversation” I engage in every day with other technical writers at work.
Often times, I have questions about grammar or style issues that either I don’t remember or cannot find in the style guides. I’ll message a colleague on Lotus SameTime (our internal instant messaging software) and the conversation would look something like the following.
Shanghai Tech Writer does the word “both” and “either” connotate that there are two (and only two) options?
Another Tech Writer Can you use it in a sentence?
Shanghai Tech Writer like “Both A and B” — but you can’t say “Both A, B, and C”, right?
Another Tech Writer No, you can’t say “Both A, B, and C”. So yes, “Both” connotes there are two options.
Shanghai Tech Writer so how do you say something like “Both A, B, and C”?
All A, B, and C? — sounds weird.
Another Tech Writer Can you not use “Both”?
Shanghai Tech Writer Also it’s “Either A or B” — but not “Either A, B, or C”?
Another Tech Writer I think you can say “Either A, B, or C”. But I’m not entirely sure. Might be better to use “among”. “Between” is like a choice between A and B. “Among” is a choice between more than one thing. But I don’t think that helps with what you’re asking.
Shanghai Tech Writer The “both” puzzles me greatly. The reason we use “both” is to emphasize both A and B but what if I want to emphasize A, B, and C?
Another Tech Writer both(a): (used with count nouns) two considered together; the two;
“both girls are pretty”
Shanghai Tech Writer what about me and my two sisters? There are three of us!!!
Another Tech Writer “They are all pretty”
Try this page for the rule! http://www.bartleby.com/64/C001/026.html
Shanghai Tech Writer So you can’t use “either” for more than two… we have to use “any” instead.
Now the question is, does “any” in “any of the a, b, c, d, and e” mean only one? Because either means only one — choose one. I think i asked you about this once, like you gave an example “do you have any pencils”?
Another Tech Writer Hmm….these are tough questions! For “either”, it says you can use “either” if in a serial list.
“When using either as a conjunction, you can apply it to more than two elements in a series: ‘She left her glove either at the convenience store, the library, or the playground.’ ”
Shanghai Tech Writer okay, so “any of the 5 pencils” means 1. Do you have any pencils? You can choose any of the 5 pencils?
Another Tech Writer “Do you have any pencils” means do you have at least 1 pencil? You can respond with “Yes, in fact, I have two pencils”
Shanghai Tech Writer ahh….. if only that means the same when someone asked me “You can have any of the 5 luxury cars.” “I’ll take all 5 please.”
Another Tech Writer Or be explicit and say “You can choose only one of the 5 luxury cars.” Oh, but now that brings us back to the “of” issue.
When you say “You can have any of the 5 luxury cars,” you’re saying I can choose from among those 5 cars. Whatever I choose belongs to one of those 5 cars.
But I don’t know if that means I can choose 1 or more than 1.
Shanghai Tech Writer but the page you sent me says “any” is used in place of “either” — meaning there should be only 1. But in English, that’s not always the case or assumption.
Like I would tell me students, “you can choose from any of the prizes in the box” and they’d ask me, “how many”?
Another Tech Writer Maybe your students are just greedy. I think English is so misconstrued these days. Lawyers are probably very good grammarians. “He said I could have either the kids, the house, or the yacht. So I took them all!”
Shanghai Tech Writer that doesn’t make sense — either means one.
“both,” “either,” and “neither” = 2, 1, 0
Another Tech Writer Ok, you’re right. I’m just getting more lost as I read more articles about these word usages. Have mercy on me….
Shanghai Tech Writer can I copy/paste this conversation on a blog post?
Another Tech Writer NO!
Shanghai Tech Writer Typical conversation as a technical writer.
Another Tech Writer Was this all a ploy just to get a chat conversation going about writing? You don’t really care which word to use, do you?!?!
Shanghai Tech Writer no. i have been stumped by the use of “both”
Another Tech Writer Oh, ok
Shanghai Tech Writer I want to use “both” for more than 2 items
Another Tech Writer You can’t. It’s against the laws of grammar
Shanghai Tech Writer but the exception for “either” in conjunction says you can use for more than 2 items. “Either A, B, or C”
Another Tech Writer But I do agree with you that “both,” “either,” “neither” correspond with 2, 1, 0. And as a conjunction, “either” must be used with “or”. Like you said, the choice is among two or more, but you can only choose one.
Shanghai Tech Writer so that means both must be used with “and”
Another Tech Writer Yes. “Both….and”. “Either….or”. “Neither….nor” Now let’s debate whether to you’re supposed to say “NEEther” or “NYEther”
Shanghai Tech Writer Neither A, B, nor C
Either A, B, or C
Both A, B, and C
Another Tech Writer No! You CAN’T say “Both A, B, and C”. If “both” is for two items, how can you say “Both A, B, and C”? That’s three items!
Shanghai Tech WriterI know, but if “either” and “neither” can have exceptions as a conjunction, why can’t “both”?
Another Tech Writer It’s about among how many you can choose (Both=2, Either=2+, Neither=2+) and how many you actually choose (Both=2, Either=1, Neither=0)
Shanghai Tech Writer actually, “neither” is none of the two
http://www.bartleby.com/64/C001/038.html#NEITHER1
so if more than two, you don’t use “neither.” It’s just “none of the three”
Another Tech Writer Oh … so Both=2/2, Either=2+/1, Neither=2/0, and None=3+/0.
ALL of this is confusing me even more.
Shanghai Tech Writer oh, another fun day at work! can’t i please post any of the above?
Another Tech Writer Ok ok. Blur out my name. This conversation has too many mistakes.
It makes us look unintelligent, but I guess it’s a real conversation.
Shanghai Tech Writer it’s technical writing…. that’s what we’re trying to figure out
Another Tech Writer I haven’t figured anything out after this conversation though. I feel lost and confused. And scared of writing.
And that’s the nature (and humor) of technical writing. We have to be so precise in our documentation that we’d spend hours and hours discussing an issue to death. And by the end of these conversations, I can’t always say we’ve accomplished or figured anything out.
If you’ve read this post / conversation in its entirety, you’re probably a technical writer too!
Fun times.
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